| Pages in topic: < [1 2] | How strict are you re: invoices? Thread poster: Emma Page
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| No, you don't need to put it on your invoice | Jun 25, 2018 |
Nikki Scott-Despaigne wrote:
Yes, there are various European provisions. However, contractual provisions can go beyond those minimum statutory provisions. For example, in France, you can also legally add a flat-fee 40€ penalty for late payment, but you can only recover it if you have put it on your invoice. Also, you can also establish a rate of interest for late payment that is higher than the statutory rate, usually derisory. Anything above the statutory rate has to be provided for, otherwise you cannot apply it.
As France is an EU Member State, they apply EU law, and EU law does not require that you put the statutory provisions on the invoice. See the link I posted. The French requirement you refer to applied before this 2011 Directive entered into force.
The statutory interest is at least 8%, and the statutory penalty €40 per invoice in addition to a statutory right to recover recovery costs.
Of course you can make contractual provisions for more than this.
| | | | Sheila Wilson 
Spain
Local time: 05:16
Member (2007)
English
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| Their client's payment - or lack of payment - is irrelevant. | Jun 25, 2018 |
Emma Page wrote:
Not long ago I did some subcontracting work, where the payment terms were clearly stated upfront. 45 days for the end client, thus 45 days for me after the end client had been invoiced.
Am I understanding that correctly? Does it mean they proposed to pay you 90 days after completing the job? Did you send the invoice straight away or did you have to wait until 45 days after delivery before sending it? It all sounds very odd. As others have said, the end client doesn't enter into the contract between you and your client.
Any business that orders work to be done should already have the means to pay for that work. If they haven't, they'll have to borrow money to cover that debt, not expect the supplier to wait. If their normal business practice is to order services they can't yet pay for then they are likely to go into liquidation the first time a major client defaults on payment. Don't make their loss your loss - ditch them if they're that bad! At the very least you need to make the ground rules clear now.
| | | | Emma Page
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:16
French to English
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TOPIC STARTER | You're right, it is very odd. Chalk it up to my inexperience... | Jun 25, 2018 |
Sheila Wilson wrote: Emma Page wrote:
Not long ago I did some subcontracting work, where the payment terms were clearly stated upfront. 45 days for the end client, thus 45 days for me after the end client had been invoiced. Am I understanding that correctly? Does it mean they proposed to pay you 90 days after completing the job? Did you send the invoice straight away or did you have to wait until 45 days after delivery before sending it? It all sounds very odd. As others have said, the end client doesn't enter into the contract between you and your client. Any business that orders work to be done should already have the means to pay for that work. If they haven't, they'll have to borrow money to cover that debt, not expect the supplier to wait. If their normal business practice is to order services they can't yet pay for then they are likely to go into liquidation the first time a major client defaults on payment. Don't make their loss your loss - ditch them if they're that bad! At the very least you need to make the ground rules clear now.
This was proofreading work on my part, with a 45-day payment term (or so I was informed) between my client (let's call them X) and end-client. X informed me that I should invoice them upon completion with a payment term of 45 days from my date of delivery, making it clear that would be "late-june". I did as such, with a date clearly stated on the invoice. X confirmed receipt of invoice. 45 days later, X says they are chasing the end-client, and "will pay me from their own funds" if things get "unreasonable".
My reply was that, politely, the end of the month was my deadline for "unreasonable" and I expect to be paid within 5 business days. I will certainly be ultra-clear about the fact that end-client late payment is not an excuse for any delay in the future, with any client who appears fuzzy on the matter....
| | | | Helen Shiner
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:16
German to English
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| Translator sets the terms | Jun 25, 2018 |
We all do things differently, I'm aware. However, as far as I am concerned, I am the one who sets the terms as a freelance/independent translator. We are not employees. I stipulate that payment should be made strictly within the 30 days following receipt of my invoice. I always submit my invoices along with the translation I am returning - i.e. as joint e-mail attachments. After a few bogus claims from clients, I now always have proof that if clients have received the translation from me (I alwa... See more We all do things differently, I'm aware. However, as far as I am concerned, I am the one who sets the terms as a freelance/independent translator. We are not employees. I stipulate that payment should be made strictly within the 30 days following receipt of my invoice. I always submit my invoices along with the translation I am returning - i.e. as joint e-mail attachments. After a few bogus claims from clients, I now always have proof that if clients have received the translation from me (I always ask for confirmation of this), they have the invoice.
Obviously some clients request that a translator send an invoice to a separate accounting address. I also do this on the same day, and may copy in the e-mail address of the person who has commissioned the translation at first, until a good working partnership has been established.
I can only think of one situation when I agreed to 45 days, and that was a favour for someone I knew.
What you choose to do will depend on the nature of the clients for whom you work (mine are mostly direct clients) and the frequency and length of the translations concerned. If you have many small translations from a client during the month, then a monthly invoice might make more sense, I agree.
When a direct client is new to me, I generally ask for payment upfront, or part-payment, if the project is large. I will make exceptions for large, well-known institutions, such as, for instance, museums, but not for individuals. ▲ Collapse
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Emma, in your first post you wrote :
"45 days for the end client, thus 45 days for me after the end client had been invoiced." ???
That's odd, not normal and gave rise to posts along those lines. You should basically invoice when you deliver the job, unless it's a periodic invoice for a number of jobs and that this method has been agreed to upfront. In that case, the periodic invoice is submitted (generally) at the end of a month and the time limit for payment is, XYZ. ... See more Emma, in your first post you wrote :
"45 days for the end client, thus 45 days for me after the end client had been invoiced." ???
That's odd, not normal and gave rise to posts along those lines. You should basically invoice when you deliver the job, unless it's a periodic invoice for a number of jobs and that this method has been agreed to upfront. In that case, the periodic invoice is submitted (generally) at the end of a month and the time limit for payment is, XYZ. But as I understand you now, this is not in fact what was agreed.
Looking at what you write now, the client did not suggest that you submit your invoice when it (your client) submitted its invoice to the end-client. After all, that is something you have neither any control over, nor any means of knowing when that is done. Bl***y odd, You now say that your client asked to you submit your invoice upon delivery. If that's the case, that's fine, logical and clear. If you agreed to 45 days, well...
In fact, I'm not really sure there is a problem at all with the submission date for your invoice. Did you submit the invoice with the translation? Is that what was agreed?
However, if the basic problem is the age-old excuse that they are not intending to pay you until the end-client pays them, this is the basic privity of contract thing. That's your client's problem, not yours. You are a supplier of translation services, not of banking services. If they really need to wait for that money to come in before they can afford to pay you, they are having cashflow problems. Make sure they remain theirs and don't become yours. Take all the necessary steps for recovery. Whack on the statutory interest rate together with the 40€ equivalent recovery fee. Send them an updated invoice now with this added on. This will show you mean business. If they still don't pay up, go ahead take action for recovery. Small claims procedure?
Supposing you are in the UK, these sources may help :
https://www.gov.uk/invoicing-and-taking-payment-from-customers (see the three sections)
http://www.mycreditcontrollers.co.uk/Articles/how-late-is-an-invoice-still-valid.html
[Edited at 2018-06-25 19:20 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Pages in topic: < [1 2] | To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator: You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request » How strict are you re: invoices? | Trados Business Manager Lite | Create customer quotes and invoices from within Trados Studio
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